Comments on: Men on Women and a Woman on Men

By: Joseph Arpaia

Joseph Arpaia — Thu, 07 Jan 2010 15:00:02 +0000

Barbara,

Sorry you got hit so hard emotionally, but you had a hidden selection bias. You did not interview a random sampling of men but rather ONLY MEN WHO WERE WILLING TO “OPEN UP”.

As a psychiatrist I can assure you that you did not get a representative sample. You inadvertently selected for people who needed to confess, and used you for that purpose.

By: Crazy Mermaid

Crazy Mermaid — Thu, 07 Jan 2010 05:38:33 +0000

If you like to watch people crack and fall apart, it sounds like Barbara came very very close to becoming your entertainment. Speaking from the perspective of someone who did crack and come apart, I can tell you that the manic side is the most seductive drug in the universe, but the depression side is just this side of Hell. I hope Barbara, had she gone there, saw the manic rather than depression side of “cracked”.

By: Doug Bremner

Doug Bremner — Wed, 06 Jan 2010 14:43:14 +0000

I saw that, that was pretty funny. I’m thinking that relationships, at least in the US, are a lot more messed up than I thought they were, probably because the media is training people to focus on superficial attractions, and if that is the basis of your relationship, then what if something else catches your eye that comes along?

By: Susie

Susie — Wed, 06 Jan 2010 14:18:58 +0000

Did you come across the story about a dating website that kicked people out because they have gained weight during the holidays? “beautifulpeople” — the name of the site alone says a lot about their mate-finding criteria…

By: Doug Bremner

Doug Bremner — Wed, 06 Jan 2010 13:37:13 +0000

ha ha

By: Susie

Susie — Wed, 06 Jan 2010 10:14:07 +0000

By Doug Bremner, January 5, 2010 @ 6:04 pm

I found this book intriguing because I like to watch how people crack and fall apart.

—-

… said the rubber necking psychiatrist??

By: Madison Woods

Madison Woods — Wed, 06 Jan 2010 01:24:23 +0000

Thanks for sharing your insight on that, Alice. It does sound like a depressing trend you’ve found.

By: Doug Bremner

Doug Bremner — Tue, 05 Jan 2010 23:04:51 +0000

I found this book intriguing because I like to watch how people crack and fall apart.

By: Steve

Steve — Tue, 05 Jan 2010 22:23:28 +0000

Thank you for the responses Barbara, makes the book and discussion much more intriguing.
To be clear, I never would have thought you had any intent to skew the “results” of your interviews.
But the examples you have shared here, and the effect you describe it having on you (understandably!) lead me to believe that the greatest majority of men have very serious issues with relationships.
Such findings are really striking and worth looking at further.
Perhaps some of the big money being spent in “defense of marriage” would be better channeled to funding such a project!
I’ll have to read though your remarks regarding the other comments. again, thanks!

By: Doug Bremner

Doug Bremner — Tue, 05 Jan 2010 21:48:26 +0000

Barbara emailed me her responses (btw Barbara you should join facebook cuz there are about 35 comments over there)

1. Steve:
There was no deliberate strategy on my part. I knew I needed to keep the interviews balanced, and so I would qualify the guys before I headed out to listen to their tales. About 50% of the men were married and most of those claimed to be happily married. The confusing part was that once they opened up, they did not sound very happy. It was as if they had programmed themselves like Steppford husbands. I AM HAPPY. I AM A FAILURE IF I AM NOT HAPPILY MARRIED.

I found that the gay guys I interviewed – if they were in a committed relationship – were much more committed to their partner. Maybe it was fear of loneliness, or maybe they placed a higher value on their word.

One of the thoughts I came away with was that frequently men harbor that little boy deep inside. The one that felt as if he could put something over on mom (can’t fool dad.) It’s still there with a lot of these guys. It’s the competition and also the idea, can I sneak this one past her? Just one more time, and then one more time. Go Tiger.

Madison,

I got the feeling that guys saw cheating as:

1. Sex is fun – that’s an easy answer.

2. The competition. I’m smarter than she is. I can get her in bed and my wife/girlfriend won’t find out. AND even if wife does find out, she won’t leave me. Where would she ever find a prize like me? I’m one of a kind – said the senator to the governor to the president to the golfer.

3. And yes, men who were active in their churches were much less inclined…not perfect… but less inclined to cheat. Whereas guys who saw themselves as examples of what a religious man should be cheated like bandits, and wrote it off in the confessional.

More to follow.

In general one of the things that stood out was how the ME-generation has affected / infected the other generations. When I started the interviews, I could count on guys of a certain age being all about honor. That changed as I progressed through the six years of listening. Somehow the concept of honor disappeared down a black hole, and sucked the older generations with it.

Used to be that guys knew at a certain age they had to turn themselves in to “finishing school” – the military. They knew exactly what to expect and when to complete the wild-oat sowing. I’m not advocating the return of the draft, but a young man did know what to expect and what was expected from him at 18 -at 21 -at 25. Older guys I interviewed were darn proud of their military training -whatever type of training it was. We don’t have that benchmark anymore.

Now men have no idea what’s expected of them. Guys and girls are free-wheeling and texting about themselves 24/7. All of a sudden their every thought is somehow important to everyone on their network of friends. They’ll do or say anything for attention.

It’s almost like relationships are less about sex and more about competition and headlines.

More to come

The happiest marriages I found were those that were:
1. childless by choice
2. had married their high school / college sweetheart. These couples found each other early before any major damage was done to their beings. They grew together and supported each other like two trunks of one tree. These men were truly happy and didn’t have to tell me how happy they thought they were. It showed in the use of the word “we” instead of “I” and/or “my wife.”

That’s it for today!